Liv Hall, who has a Masters in Gender from the London School of Economics (how cool is that!), is also a poet/theatre-maker who refuses to accept the notion that she’s ‘too much’ – and hopes her show is helping others see that, too. Plus she talks about body positivity, and teaching high-school students about consent. Also, who knew that women were diagnosed with ‘hysteria’ for thousands of years?
Has anyone else ever been told they’re ‘too much’? That they’re being too emotional, too loud, too ‘messy’, too sensitive? Have you ever been told to pipe down, to calm down, to tone it down? Yep, me too. These words and labels are often used as a way to police and shame women’s behaviour, but what if we could reclaim and be proud of our ‘muchness’?
Auckland-based poets Liv Hall and Carrie Rudzinski, who have been creating some of the fiercest and funniest work in New Zealand’s theatre scene, are currently performing Hysterical: a poetry-theatre show that tackles gendered expectations, shame, rage, rape culture, body positivity and body politics, crying, the ‘overwhelm’ of emotions, vulnerability, and resistance to labels. “There’s absolutely anger and rage, but a lot of joy, and friendship at the core,” Liv tells me over Zoom. “It’s a show born out of us pushing back against this idea that women are ‘too emotional’. In fact, it tries to reclaim having ‘big emotions’ and show how that can actually be a valuable way that we connect with others; in the show we share a lot of personal information about ourselves and our lives.”
“We’re also reclaiming the word ‘hysterical’.”
The show’s title is a reference to a) humour and b) the fact that women used to be diagnosed with ‘hysteria’. Originating from the Greek word for uterus, hysteria was often considered to be linked to the female reproductive system. Physical and mental symptoms dubbed part of ‘hysteria’ included anxiety, insomnia, extreme fatigue, emotional ‘outbursts’, depression, seizures, and sexual dysfunction. In the Middle Ages, “hysterical” women were subjected to exorcism because the condition was associated with the devil. In 18th– and 19th-century Europe, women with ‘hysteria’ were often treated dismissively, blamed for their condition, and sometimes subject to pointless, invasive treatments. Imagine all the perimenopausal women – and women struggling with their mental health – told to stop being so hysterical. And would you believe that, until 1980, ‘hysterical neurosis’ was a formally studied psychological disorder?
“I was actually doing my Masters in Gender at the London School of Economics when we started conceptualising this show,” Liv says. “For my thesis, I was looking into the medical idea of hysteria, where it stemmed from, and the ways in which that has carried through to the current day, particularly in the medical system. Even in today’s medical system, there’s still a very clear link to this original label given to women who dared to try and get medical support for issues they were having.”
Outside the medical system, why do some women still get told we’re ‘too emotional’ or ‘too much’? “I think it starts with ‘little things’ including being told you’re ‘too sensitive’ as a child, and young girls being called bossy rather than assertive. We use this quite gendered language for things that are often praised in boys or young men, while girls or young women are told it’s not appropriate when they display the same behaviours. I think people underestimate how much those little language differences matter; actually, young children pick up on them. I was told off a lot for being loud at school. It filtered through to me feeling that the way I express myself is not really OK and I need to dampen that down.”
“I’ve been called ‘too loud’ consistently throughout my life. Sometimes it’s more a feeling than people saying it directly, but in lots of social situations I often feel I’m being ‘too loud’. And there’s this attitude from men that they don’t like loud, ‘overly’ confident woman, and they’re sort of trying to take you down a peg.”
Body positivity is an important topic in Hysterical. “I very comfortably identify as living in a fat body, and I perform a solo poem in the show that specifically talks about my experiences with fat phobia, and the complex, rollercoaster experience of trying to live in a body that society tells you isn’t acceptable. That’s a vulnerable thing for me, but I think it’s really important to explore in the show, because hearing something like this would have meant so much to me as a young woman.”
Hysterical won Best New Aotearoa Play at the Wellington Fringe Awards and Outstanding Performance Poetry at Auckland Fringe Festival. They’ve performed it around NZ, and in London and at the Edinburgh Fringe Festival in 2023 (quite the coup). On Saturday, they’re performing it at the Hawke’s Bay Arts Festival. Look out for other performances in the future. If you don’t think a poetry performance is your thing, you might be surprised.
“People sometimes have this very set notion of what poetry is and what it can be, and maybe it’s only what we encountered in Year 11 English at school. A thing I’ve seen time and time again with Hysterical, is that people didn’t think poetry was for them or didn’t think they could connect to poetry. But people do really emotionally connect with the show.”
What does she hope women – particularly young women – have taken away from the show in the past, and may do in the future? “I hope women leave feeling empowered to use their voices and speak up for themselves and what they care about.”
“We sell books of our poetry after the show, which gives people the opportunity to chat to us. It’s really beautiful almost all the time. People might talk to us about which little pieces of the show – maybe a poem or an idea – really spoke to them. They sometimes express or share things that they’ve experienced.” Very occasionally, some mention their experiences of sexual assault.
I tell Liv that the Aotearoa Gender Attitudes Survey shows 40% of men and 27% of women think false rape accusations are common.
Liv nods. “I also teach healthy relationships and consent programmes in high schools. I’ve seen that messaging [about false rape accusations], particularly in boys schools’ as I’m teaching around consent. There’s this real concern that women will change their minds after things have happened and that they’ll lie, or take back their consent. I think this idea is being propagated on the internet, because some of these boys have strongly-held ideas about it and are defensive. It’s pretty alarming. I spend a lot of time on [talking about] it and find that most of them are genuinely coming from a place of fear. I think academically and creatively about these ideas a lot, but it’s a different thing to see what young people are saying.”
I also tell her that the survey shows one in three young men in New Zealand believe that gender equality has gone too far. “I think that’s something that comes from people like Andrew Tate in the manosphere – this idea that feminism has never been about equality, and has always been about women having more power than men. But I’d love to know how they think that looks in society. Are they seeing that play out? What does it mean for it to have gone ‘too far’? Do they truly believe that they’re living in a society where women have more power than men? Because that feels hard to imagine from where I’m sitting.”
Not to ask her a big question or anything, but where does she think feminism is at? “I think it looks like constant activism is required for all the things happening in the world – and, certainly for me, it’s incredibly intersectional. I think what is fundamental are the ways in which people are oppressed and discriminated against all overlap with each other, and with the patriarchy.”
So if we’re feeling (extremely valid) anger or rage at the state of the world, and/or our own experiences, how do we express that? Should we warn the people around us that we’re about to let out a loud scream? “I think it’s really important to carve out very safe places for us to be rageful or to feel big feelings, with people that are supportive of that. It’s big in my friendships. I get on the phone when I’m incredibly frustrated or angry or sit down in person with a close friend. Or send a long rambly voice note while I’m driving and know someone else will listen to it and meet me where I’m at.”
Liv and Carrie perform Hysterical at the Hawke’s Bay Arts Festival on Saturday October 11, 6pm
